:-\ huh?
Was the idea to get all the early reviews praising a new lower price point of 1299 then jack up the price days later? I never saw mention of an introductory price.
Now 1499.00 with a parts down grade, cheaper rims etc.
Good catch, RR.
Somebody in Marketing really screwed up at Rad, if that higher price was really necessary due to increasing costs so soon after launch - they probably figured sales would be zero if the Expand was the same price at the Minis, but they do want to clear out Minis, and pricing the same would have done that. But having introduced Expand at $1,299, they should have also planned to hold the intro price for at least a few months and eat the costs if necessary to get the new model out there without making potential new buyers mad.
The "Expand" is really a "Contract" compared to the Minis even at $1,299, now embarrassingly so at the same price. Now they're going to be saddled with a newly-pricier bike that is obviously inferior in pretty much every way to the Minis. I bet they're thinking "well, with the Minis sold out, what are the alternatives?" At which point, 'Lectric and other competitors say "hold my beer."
I can't wait to see how the several "reviewers" in the tank for Rad and who soft-peddle every disadvantage, handle this. I bet they just ignore it. (I don't consider Ryan one of those; he doesn't seem to compromise to get pre-release bikes just to have vids on release day - by comparison, the "review" from EBR made me cringe while watching.)
Two things...
First, if this was the thinking, then I would be SUPER unimpressed with them.... I''m guessing it wasn't... but that it doesn't hurt... well, doesn't hurt...
Second, ARE THEY REALLY DISCONTINUING THE MINI? LIKE EVERYWHERE IN THE WORLD??
I have been hearing/reading disturbing rumours on these internets but, you know, I was ignorning them for the moment. But... what's the reality?
I have a mini... I LOVE MY MINI. IT simply will not last forever. I don't really want to (not have the random cash nor the space) for a second bike/another mini/backup mini, but what to do?!?
Thank you for settling my uncertainties, as scary as they may be!
Quote from: Radio Runner on March 26, 2022, 08:53:37 AM
:-\ huh?
Was the idea to get all the early reviews praising a new lower price point of 1299 then jack up the price days later? I never saw mention of an introductory price.
Now 1499.00 with a parts down grade, cheaper rims etc.
Makes you wonder. Were margins on the Mini so slim that it wasn't profitable? I mean, it's just so much more bike for the price. Glad I got my Mini ST -- every time those front shocks soak up a pothole for instance, and I can't imagine riding without a Watt meter (that's half the fun!).
This is beyond what I can imagine and the only plausible explanation is really what is already explained. Great insight JimInPT. What advice can I give? Please buy now before the price gets even higher?? :)
If a Mini (non ST) is in your future, you should buy now. That is probably the next model to be discontinued and, as we saw, that can get messy.
we have 4 RADS now 3, No more city for me. The Mini fits me better and rides well I don't even miss my City bike!
Why did they raise prices? 1. Because they can! They probably have to to keep margin in check.
Boy am I glad I got the Mini4 and ST2 a few weeks ago! I was expecting an Expand5 Plus for 1500, I never imagined they'd just bump the price of an inferior product like that. There may still be a Plus for like $1700 with suspension back, but I agree, that gives competitors a lot of wiggle room to provide the bang for the buck.
Here is my RadExpand review. Hopefully, it helps those considering it: https://youtu.be/qJZiFsO5Npo
Just finished watching Ryan's YouTube and it's a bit shocking. Apart from the big stuff like, no shocks or LCD, there's a long list of areas where Rad cheaped-out just a little -- nameplate, pant protector, pedals, seat, grips, bell -- all inferior, I think most would agree, to name just a few.
Quote from: Smackums on March 29, 2022, 09:24:04 AM
Boy am I glad I got the Mini4 and ST2 a few weeks ago! I was expecting an Expand5 Plus for 1500, I never imagined they'd just bump the price of an inferior product like that. There may still be a Plus for like $1700 with suspension back, but I agree, that gives competitors a lot of wiggle room to provide the bang for the buck.
Quote from: NaturallyRC on April 01, 2022, 02:58:11 PM
Just finished watching Ryan's YouTube and it's a bit shocking. Apart from the big stuff like, no shocks or LCD, there's a long list of areas where Rad cheaped-out just a little -- nameplate, pant protector, pedals, seat, grips, bell -- all inferior, I think most would agree, to name just a few.
Quote from: Smackums on March 29, 2022, 09:24:04 AM
Boy am I glad I got the Mini4 and ST2 a few weeks ago! I was expecting an Expand5 Plus for 1500, I never imagined they'd just bump the price of an inferior product like that. There may still be a Plus for like $1700 with suspension back, but I agree, that gives competitors a lot of wiggle room to provide the bang for the buck.
And still waiting for someone to unmount a tire to check the new style rims. I have a sneaking suspicion they are now single wall construction instead of double wall.
Never thought of that. Thumbs up.
Quote from: Radio Runner on April 01, 2022, 11:53:10 PM
waiting for someone to unmount a tire to check the new style rims. I have a sneaking suspicion they are now single wall construction instead of double wall.
I just purchased the Rad Expand 5 last week, but it wasn't without heavy consideration. I read obsessively about the Mini Step Thru 2 and the differences between it and the Expand. I took both for multiple test drives... originally convinced I would opt for the Mini Step Thru 2. Yes, the suspension was nice, but with the Expand, the lack suspension didn't feel terrible (most of my riding will be on trails and street). But at the end of the day, the difference in the handlebars was the decider. For me, the handlebars on the Mini Step Thru 2 were quite uncomfortable, while the Expand 5 felt much, much better. While I'm aware that some of the components on the Expand are lesser quality, ultimately he Expand was a better fit for me.
A note about the price: I went to the showroom understanding the price of the Expand to be $1299. When they rang me up it was listed as $1499 and I told them it should be $1299. Turns out the price change happened that day, and they honored the lower price since I mentioned it. And I was able to upgrade to the LCD display for half price.
Eleni
Good job getting a fair price. Thumbs up.
Quote from: EleniS on April 02, 2022, 10:17:06 PM
I just purchased the Rad Expand 5 last week, but it wasn't without heavy consideration. I read obsessively about the Mini Step Thru 2 and the differences between it and the Expand. I took both for multiple test drives... originally convinced I would opt for the Mini Step Thru 2. Yes, the suspension was nice, but with the Expand, the lack suspension didn't feel terrible (most of my riding will be on trails and street). But at the end of the day, the difference in the handlebars was the decider. For me, the handlebars on the Mini Step Thru 2 were quite uncomfortable, while the Expand 5 felt much, much better. While I'm aware that some of the components on the Expand are lesser quality, ultimately he Expand was a better fit for me.
A note about the price: I went to the showroom understanding the price of the Expand to be $1299. When they rang me up it was listed as $1499 and I told them it should be $1299. Turns out the price change happened that day, and they honored the lower price since I mentioned it. And I was able to upgrade to the LCD display for half price.
Eleni
I wonder if Rad killed the Mini and upped the price of the Expand after seeing sales of the Rad Runner Plus get siphoned away. No company wants to cannibalize its own shelf, and product managers within the same company can be very territorial, in my experience. Just a thought.
I was thinking of selling my Rover 5 and getting a Mini but all I see now is the Expand 5 which I don't think is worth $1,499. I have a 2020 Camry and don't have a way to transport my Rover 5 so I thought getting a folding bike would work if it will fit in my Camry. I guess I will need to look around at the different brands to see what's out there other than RAD.
Jim
I watched a review the other day for a cargo bike that blows the RadWagon clean out of the water. When I looked up the price - $8,000 US! Rad has taken heat here lately over the Expando, but at the end of the day, RAD makes great bikes imho for folks who don't have piles of dough. It's all relative, as they say.
Quote from: jbfoster on April 09, 2022, 06:34:16 PM
I was thinking of selling my Rover 5 and getting a Mini but all I see now is the Expand 5 which I don't think is worth $1,499. I have a 2020 Camry and don't have a way to transport my Rover 5 so I thought getting a folding bike would work if it will fit in my Camry. I guess I will need to look around at the different brands to see what's out there other than RAD.
Jim
Quote from: NaturallyRC on April 10, 2022, 05:25:40 AM
I watched a review the other day for a cargo bike that blows the RadWagon clean out of the water. When I looked up the price - $8,000 US! Rad has taken heat here lately over the Expando, but at the end of the day, RAD makes great bikes imho for folks who don't have piles of dough. It's all relative, as they say.
Yes. Why did Rad raised the price on the Mini ST? Because they can and because they know there is no competition.
The price for the Mini ST has always been abnormally low relative to the rest of the line. I think it was actually $1400 or $1500 and was a hidden bargain last year. Then it dropped to $1300. And then with some discounts, it got lower. It went back up to $1500. There were bargains when they were shutting down production but the bargains are gone. But I waited 2.5 months for mine so there was a downside.
The Rad Wagon was around $1500 last year and suddenly went up to $2000 now.
If you look at the long history, the Expand is about what you expect in price with inflation what it is now. It is not as cheap as if you bought last year but I don't expect supplies to improve much this year so maybe it is still a good price. Now that the ST is gone, you can't really compare the Expand with an out of production fire sale.
I still like this style of bikes a lot. It has no semi-integrated battery and is good for tinkering. Semi-integrated batteries are great until it dies. Are there replacements? And if you use another brand, what will you do, leave a hole in the frame? The size of the company means there will be a market for mods and parts.
NaturallyRC, when I bought my RW4 last year I did the same thing as you. I looked around at the various "normal" ebikes and compared prices. Where I live the bikes in the showroom STARTED at $4000.00 and go up from there. The cargo bike they had was listed at almost $10,000.00. It could have hit $12,000.00 depending on what one ordered for it. I actually wanted a cargo bike and my RW4 cost $2300.00 after taxes and it does everything the more expensive bikes do and I can afford it.
Certainly it may not do everything as well such as climb a hill as effectively, go as far on a single charge (maybe, I don't know how far the other cargo ebikes can go) and I don't have the bike shop that deals specifically with parts etc. But my bike rides just as well, carries more than enough cargo, has as many accessories available etc so it was a great choice for me.
Great comment, Dday. Here's something else interesting. On the Canadian site, the Expand is $1,599 CAD or 1,269.65 USD instead of $1,499 USD. (Canadian bikes can be less expensive due to a smaller motor, but that's a lot). The mini price is $1,849 CAD (still available).
Quote from: Ddaybc on April 10, 2022, 08:01:51 AM
NaturallyRC, when I bought my RW4 last year I did the same thing as you. I looked around at the various "normal" ebikes and compared prices. Where I live the bikes in the showroom STARTED at $4000.00 and go up from there. The cargo bike they had was listed at almost $10,000.00. It could have hit $12,000.00 depending on what one ordered for it. I actually wanted a cargo bike and my RW4 cost $2300.00 after taxes and it does everything the more expensive bikes do and I can afford it.
Certainly it may not do everything as well such as climb a hill as effectively, go as far on a single charge (maybe, I don't know how far the other cargo ebikes can go) and I don't have the bike shop that deals specifically with parts etc. But my bike rides just as well, carries more than enough cargo, has as many accessories available etc so it was a great choice for me.